Something to something
I'm not sure how far I'm going to get here.....
The clock on the wall says 12:27 even though it is really 4:27. Man, don't I wish I could turn the clock back 4 hours like that... I could use them today.
I only had two classes, my Calculus class this morning and my Computer Science class in the afternoon. I spent part of the day trying to catch up on assignments for next week (I have more than I bargained for).
The instructor realized (in the Calculus class) that he had an old syllabus. I was wondering why we had left off in chapter 6 (in Calculus 1) and now were heading straight into chapter 12. We'll be going back and looking at some of the other stuff before going to chapter 12 now (*phew*).
Then I went to the computer lab, printed out some notes for next Digital Logic Design lecture to be used in conjunction with the slides presented, and visited a couple of sites that I'm supposed to keep tabs on during the semester. Each professor says "check the website regularly!" Okay, I'll just bookmark them all and check when I do my rounds every day (or multiple times every day usually). Then I had about an hour to sit around and read (more Pink). I went to the room where the next class was to be and there was 4 other students there, ones from last semester that I knew. It was almost like a handpicked crowd!
When classtime finally came, the professor was just as likeable the second time around, he mentioned that he has a large library of Old Time Radio shows, as do I myself! I stayed around and talked with him for about 10 minutes on some of that, we have similar tastes and I recognized all of the shows he mentioned and he knew the ones I liked. It sounds like we have a lot in common even in that one area.
Then I headed to the bookstore to wait for about 15 minutes for another "customer" to show up so I could sell him my Java (not coffee, programming) textbook. He came and I did. He was an Asian student and he said he will be taking CS2 next semester and if I was interested in selling that book after this one was over (providing they were using the same book) he'd definitely be interested in buying it from me. All right! A customer even before I've advertised! On that same note, I got an e-mail from another person when I got home who was wondering if I still had my Chemistry book and if so then he'd buy it from me. I'm very pleased (and thankful). I've only had one person contact me for each book, but one is all it takes! Thanks to the teachers who announced it in class as well, I'm very appreciative they took the time to do that when I couldn't be there myself due to schedule conflicts.
Anyhow.... as I was leaving the Student Union (and feeling slightly hungry as it was now nearing 1:45) I came across a table by the clock outside that had some Bibles and stuff. Christians on Campus or something like that. So I stopped and talked with "Troy" a while, he seemed like a nice fellow. I asked what version of the Bible they had and he said it was the "Re...." come to think of it, I can't think of what it was. I'd never heard of it. I took a look, it was just the New Testament but what he said he really liked was the notes that it had (I had to inspect those of course) because it really explained a lot and helped him have a deeper relationship with Jesus. I took a brief look at some passages and it looked "okay." He said he liked the translation too because a lot of translations will have their opinions or what they thought of it in the way they translated (I mentioned The Message). He didn't care too much for NIV he said. Okay, I could go along with that, it sounded encouraging. He mentioned that they were going to have a Bible study that afternoon (in 45 minutes) in the Student Union on the 4th floor. I hesitated because was planning on walking all the way back to the overflow parking on the other side of the track and get home and eat some lunch but decided to go along. So I went up to the room to wait, reading my book.
The people all seemed very nice but a little on the "emotional" side in a way.....
They decided (in a couple of minutes) that they were going to study Romans, I said that was fine by me, Romans was one of my favourite books.
They didn't really open up with a prayer, they just started saying statement and then the rest would chime in with "oh yes! Amen! Jesus, Jesus, Jesus, Amen! Amen!" For example:
"We are glad to be here Jesus...."
"Oh Jesus, Jesus, Jesus!"
"We are glad for Romans"
"Amen Lord, yes, yes! Amen!"
"We are glad to read your Word."
"Amen, Yes, Jesus, oh Jesus yes, Jesus!"
etc.
I was struggling because while I do think that it should always be in our hearts to praise God for everything, it was more like repetitious words designed to inculcate some sort of emotional, religious experience.
Then they started reading, one verse at a time and at the end of each verse (and often in the middle) they would puncuate it with "Amen! Amen! Jesus, Jesus! Oh yes, Amen!"
I knew it was just kind of a mindless repetition when I read verse 14:
"I am debtor both to the Greeks and to the foreigners, both to the wise and to the unwise."
And got all kinds of "Amen! Yes Lord, yes, yes! Amen! Amen!"
Far be it from me to judge another person's heart, but did you understand that verse? Do you know what it means? And if not, then what are you thinking?
They all had those Bibles with the notes and would read those more than the Scripture. The young man had said that he didn't care for the Bibles that would translate their own ideas into the words, yet they were taking every word of the notes as absolutely true! They would "Amen" it and then someone else came in later, mentioned something along the lines of what they had read in the notes earlier and Troy said that they had read it but it wasn't very clear. All through the notes was "Yes Lord! Oh Jesus, Amen! Yes! Amen, Amen" not to anything in particular, it was almost like noises that came from their mouths when they breathed. Yes, I want to praise God but it's not simply a mindless "Amen" to every word you hear, whether you comprehend it or not (especially from someone's notes). The Bible is very clear to explain WHY we praise God, because of His mercy, power, love, holiness, etc.
At one point I was asked to read one of the notes, so I leaned over and read from another of the Bible's notes and came across the "chosen" or "called" in the first verse. It mentioned Acts 9:15, which I read.
'But the Lord said to him, "Go, for he is a chosen instrument of mine to carry my name before the Gentiles and kings and the children of Israel. '
And I got all kinds of "Amens" and one lady said "now wouldn't you like that to have been said of you? To be chosen by God!" And I looked up (quickly) Ephesians 1:3-4 which says
"Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in Christ with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places, even as he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before him." And said that it has been said of us! We have been chosen.
"Oh Jesus! Amen! Yes, Lord, Yes, Before the foundation of the world! Yes Lord, chosen!"
Then one of the guys started (in a dreamy voice) saying how wonderful it was and wow, chosen, it was almost as though we had some sort of predestination or something. Now, I wasn't prepared to go into a dialogue on Election the first meeting I'd been to but there was a screaming opportunity.
They read the notes about how the books followed some structure and it metioned chapters 1-5 as being "building" and then other chapters as being "life" and then the others as being "salvation" or something.
From then on it was almost a chant, when someone would mention being built up another would ask "and for what" And the zombied response was "to life! Life! Oh Yes! AMEN! Yes... Amen, Amen!"
I felt like I could have said anything and it would have met with emphatic approval. One of the people mentioned progressive revelation and I started to sweat. I see.... soo..... we're all infallible because we're all speaking under the Spirit and all "Amen"ing?
Then one of the guys started going off on how the Spirit was Jesus, and how when Jesus was resurrected and ascended, He became the Spirit so he could dwell in our hearts. There were some other weird things mentioned then but I didn't stay. I politely excused myself and headed out. It was hard to think in there with all the assents to whatever you said, it lulled one into a sense of infallibility and then people would start blurting out stuff that made no sense!
I don't think I'll be back.
posted by Shadow @ 2:27 PM
6 comments
6 Comments:
What an..... interesting group of people. I know I would have fellt a little awkward, and I don't think I would go back either :\ Be a little strnage for people to start saying random things that have nothing to do with the topic at hand, and after everythign you said start shouting "Amen, Jesus yes yes Amen!" I'd be a little freaked out. :\
That is providential that you've had just enough buyers for your textbooks.
*hem* That Bible study does sound rather weird. I guess that's an example of the sorts of student studies that are sadly popular these days. In the churches, there's big-screen TVs and lots of music (though not many know how to sing). And in the actual messages, I suspect there isn't much practicality or diligent study at all--just raw, emotional reactions to the text without much attempt to really discover what it means. It's sad. They're mising so much--there's so much beside the mere emotions in Scripture. Yes, emotion is part of it, but the logic, the hard truth, the carefully-reasoned theology, the history--that's all important, too, and you can't properly understand or apply any of it unless you study with a clear mind.
Ok, there's my little sermon for the day. *cough* :)
F.B.:
That's pretty much how I felt. You know, we don't have a blind faith, it's not left for us just to accept the words (though in many cases it is and should be sufficient), God has given us reason, He expects us to study diligently and apply it to our lives. Sadly, this is very lacking today in so many groups, they feel that any discussion or mention of doctrine clouds the "feel" or "joy" that you should be having. I often desire that I should love Christ more, I feel stony hearted at times, but working myself into an emotional frenzy won't help anything. How can one truly appreciate a God he or she doesn't understand or even know properly? I was reading in Pink today and he quoted Joseph Bellamy who said:
"It is true that many a carnal man is ravished to think that God loves him, and will save him; but in this case, it is not the true character of God which charms the heart: it is not God that is loved. Strictly speaking, he can only love himself, and self-love is hte source of all his affections. Or, if we call it 'love' to God, it is of no other kind than sinners feel to one another: 'for sinners also love those that love them' (Luke 6:32). The carnal Israelites gave the fullest proof of their disaffection to the Divine character (in the wilderness) as exhibited by God himself before their eyes, yet were once full of this same kind of 'love' at the side of the Red Sea."
Now maybe that comment doesn't seem all that relevant, but it is true that mere emotion cannot prove salvation. There has to be a knowing before there is a true loving, just saying you love Him doesn't prove anything, it can even deceive one's self. It is the true believer who desires, longs to know God better and Christ that will search the Scriptures diligently, will pray earnestly, and try to walk most uprightly in accordance with how his heavenly Father would have him to. There was no real seeking after knowledge, no real depth. It was true that I believe they were sincere in their affection, but how can they know Him, of whom they have not heard?
I apologize if this seems rambly. I'm tired and have had a headache ever since that study. While I was there I was having a hard time thinking very straightly as well, all of the murmuring was distracting, almost like putting one into a trance. It was almost scary in a way.
That group of people has some strange beliefs and practices. How can people do that kind of stuff and believe it? I was thinking, I keep wanting to go up to one of the Mormans and ask them, "How do you believe such nonsense?"
whose jj?
Don't you mean "who's JJ?" :) She's a person I met through The Hobbit who lives in some, secret and undisclosed state other than the one we're in.
It comes from not a very thorough study of God's Word I believe. But I have to remember that I was worse once, many people who are now strong Christians never had any belief at all, that doesn't excuse the ignorance, I pray that they will learn and come to a deeper relationship instead of a mere emotional, superficial one. Don't get me wrong, emotions are good, but they aren't the focus of what goes on.
Shadow,
Your description of the dialog reminds me of the Dufflepuds in The Voyage of the Dawn Treader:-)
It also reminds me of some of my contacts with people in "The Local Church," which is a cult. They often claim to be a group of Christians meeting together for worship and that they aren't part of a "church" or denomination. It would be interesting to know who authored the commentaries in their Bibles. "Local Church" people often focus primarily on the New Testament, as well. Maybe you've heard of this cult. I don't remember now very many details of what they believe; I have tried to forget some of those unpleasant memories. But a lot of what they say sounds really good and inviting.
-Arwen
Post a Comment
<< Home